How is Christianity trending as a religion?

cool... letting it fly

All I have to say Nick, is thank the powers that having an opinion does not require knowledge. Hence the US electoral system.

Nick;

      Excellent choices, actually, and good wording which actually delves deeper and forces a person to deal with the issue in a most realistic way...

How is Christianity trending as a religion?
Declining
Thriving
Stagnating

Not that I have a decision making vote, but this offers something to everyone and enhances the debate.

also, I think this wording is much more inclusive... we would lose a lot of public figure opinions with the negative-only approach. here it's pretty easy to classify statements... somebody that says, "it's going nowhere", for example... I'd know where to put him

one problem with using this wording is that if we ask...

Is Christianity in decline?

then when we show the affirmation, it would like like one of:

Christianity is in decline.

Christianity is not in decline.

It would be better then to ask,

How is Christianity trending as a religion?

Declining

Thriving

Stagnating

Then the affirmations look much more interesting...

Christianity is thriving.

etc.

With all this said, shall we float the issue?

Nick;

        Social network: Brother, you are the creator of the enterprise. If you call it a social network, then we shall say it is one-call it the Doctrine of Original Intent.

Dying vs. Decline: This was my take-My personal opinions aside, there is ample evidence to support the idea that Christianity is in decline, just as there is to prove that it is not. It is a reasonable debate in that sense, which is why I favored the use of that word.

Tuffy: On a personal note, thank you for your kind words. Feel free to e-mail or message me as you like. If you want to pop an artery, you can view my blog, which is registered here at WIS.oatneyworld.blogspot.com .

 I really have to say that WIS is teaching me to be OK with other people's differences, from my point of view, I honestly feel no tension and have come to view those who oppose my agenda with a new perspective. David and I agree on 44% of 245 opinions-so it's going to be a given that we're going to see things wildly different and I think it's fantastic that we can engage with each other because of our differences... I still think David is being a tad sensitive with the wording, but I respect his opinions as different from mine.  It's seriously, a very cool thing that we can all be ourselves and be a part this great big mash-up of differences.  Whether it's intentional or not, WIS is becoming a social melting pot... at least we're reaching beyond the point in our society where we're holding up mean spirited posters at protest sites and shouting at each other across police barricades and we're now actually having debates.  For all of us, that's a huge break through.  

BTW, WIS is, in my opinion, a social networking site revolving around news and information. But we all discuss and socialize and, I hope, become a closer knit network because of it. AND we do it intelligently.

My chime in is not to take the word dying so harshly. Dying is NOT dead. As for your references to druidism, etc. - Latin is considered a dead language, but is still known and practised by Roman Catholic Clergy, and various scholars, yet is referred to as "dead". Dying is defined as in decline... don't sweat it, it may NEVER die, but it may be "dying" forever... it's a figure of speech. Like when they say we are all dying from the day we are born?

"boo"

... it just feels like one of those tense rooms you walk into and everybody stops talking. I'm almost afraid to say anything... but I'll overcome it.

David... from an editorial standpoint, we don't judge the correctness of the people taking one stand over another. The part of this dialogue that is on target is whether or not dying is the right word. So, I agree with you that "decline" would be a better word.

Yes... we're a social network. We just have a particular base on which the interactions proceed... with the premise that for some it's more long-term fun to learn about and comment on the opinions of others than to keep writing, "great bbq pics fred"!

[thanks for the love tuffy]

Did they really die?

Paganism in various forms didn't die, it is still practiced. Druidism didn't die. It is rare, but certainly still practiced-as it was centuries ago. Polytheistic religion is still practiced among many tribes of people in the world. Shinto is centuries-old and its practice is becoming increasingly mixed with other religions among those (primarily in Japan) who practice it-but it still exists and has many adherants.

Some of these religious traditions are certainly in decline, but are not only not dying, they show no signs of death, since they tend to be passed down in some form from generation to generation.

As I said before...if y'all want to go with this, I won't continue to object-I think I am outvoted anyway-but I think decline is a far more accurate word to use.

I feel like a jerk always turning to a dictionary, but my professors have taught me well, not to mention my NEED for scholarships to continue school.  This should help settle the wording though.

dying

The Oxford Pocket Dictionary of Current English | Date: 2008
dy·ing / ˈdī-ing/
• adj. on the point of death: he visited his dying mother.
∎ occurring at or connected with the time that someone dies: he strained to catch her dying words. ∎ gradually ceasing to exist or function; in decline and about to disappear: stone-cutting is a dying art | the dying embers of the fire.
 

Also dying can take a LONG time.

 The true, true was from your previous statement. 

Re: If you want to go with "Is Christianity a dying religion," I will not raise further objection, though it might be argued that the way the question is phrased violates Rule 2, whereas the decline question would not.  

It's not a violation of Rule 2, Thousands of  religions, languages and cultures died throughout the course of human civilisation.  This is a historical fact, not some kind of bias against Christianity.

 true, true.. 

If you want to go with "Is Christianity a dying religion," I will not raise further objection, though it might be argued that the way the question is phrased violates Rule 2, whereas the decline question would not.

If I am the only objection among the three editors, I would say that I am outvoted anyway.

That isn't a question for the religion department, but "Is Where I Stand a Social Networking site or a News and Information site," is a good question.

David,

Well, why not have both the dying and decline questions?  Let people answer both, don't censor by way of intellectualising the rationale and logic of the question. The question is meaty and has legs and people want to express their opinions, so let them.

Also, people do not always form their opinions based on logical evidence, you're a Conservative Republican, you of all people should know that.  

Also, I find your assertion that "WIS is not a social networking site in the traditional sense" to be laughable...with regard to this very new concept of social networking on the internet what could possible qualify as "traditional"???  Facebook, MySpace are innovators but hardly can they be called "traditional" like the phone book.  

I think the concept of social networking is clearly in its infancy and WIS along with others are splintering and further defining and refining social networking on the internet.  There's noting "traditional" about what any of us are doing on Facebook or this site..

You do raise an interesting question... "Is WIS a social networking site?" 

Tuffy;

        The only basic problem with what you said is this: WIS is not a social networking sit in the traditional sense. We have Facebook for that.

The thing that makes wIs special is that it manages to do what other sites and aggregators do not: Gather, present, and compare the opinions of public figures, press organs, and bloggers based on the evidence at hand.

As an editor, I do not feel it is my place to prevent a debate on a question that I might personally view as anti-Christian (though I don't necessarily view it that way in this case), but I do feel it is my place to present an accurate question. There is little global evidence to suggest that Christianity is dying, but there is ample evidence to suggest that it may be in decline, especially in the West.

I personally do not believe it to be either dying or in decline, but I see evidence that tells me that a serious argument could be made for the latter, and I must be willing to admit that there is room for debate there.

Having taken close to 800 stands here (and I started back when the answers were just Yes/No/No Opinion-we didn't have the option to elaborate like we do now), the idea of taking a stand on an issue I am just not comfortable discussing has come up on numerous occasions-to me it is really a part of the fun of this place.

Good to read your thoughts.

*accompanying lil tuffy with light trumpet music in background, while a rainbow flag rises up the flagpole*

" Oh, thats so beautiful! "

*watches as the rays of light caress the gentle waving stripes, clutches pride rings tightly as tear trickles slowly down right cheek.*

 David,

I understand how you feel, when I saw the question, "Is Homosexuality a choice?" my claws came out, my back arched and my tail puffed. I was ready to rumble.

I got really unhinged by the notion that the majority of people using this website were not homosexual and not really in a position to comment on the question having never really experienced it in any significant way. And who the hell were these arrogant straight editors posting the sensitive question about something that nominally affected them anyway???

But then it occurred to me that people were genuinely interested in having the discussion because they valued homosexuality--on some level.  It's important  to discuss it because it's valid and people want to talk about it as evidenced by the fiery commentary and over 40 opinions.  You can't stop that because it may offend you (but trust me, I understand how you must feel).

I understand and respect what Christianity gives you and I know how exposed you must feel having every last Tom, Dick and Hillary offer their two cents on something you probably no more about than all of us combined--but my point is, is that it's valuable to have the debate.  You'll learn about  perspectives you never considered and you can have the chance to engage with people who differ from you and learn more about their perspective. And that's why WIS is a social networking site and that's why I love it.  I actually have grown a fondness for people I once considered douchebag gay haters after getting to understand why they believe what they do and sharing with them what I believe....still not agreeing, but at least talking to one another forms a bridge...  

What seems like a vulnerbale position can actually be a place of great insight, also.

I would recommend just leaving the question as is and see for yourself what others have to say, despite the fact that it might not  be what you want to read... trust me, you will gain valuable knowledge and will probably be a stronger Christian for it.

Humbly yours,

A gay marxist cat named, Lil Tuffy.

Nick;

         It isn't that there isn't a valid question here-I actually think the question of whether Christianity is declining in the West (or at least in the First World) is a valid one. To say that it is dying would not be accurate-statistically, it is growing on a worldwide basis.

How about this question: Is Christianity in decline in the post-industrialized West?

And you are right, Jesus didn't stay dead according to Christian belief-but he did die a most horrible death, and Christian belief is that his death, of course, was the atonement for the sins of all people.

Jesus died for our sins, true enough-but he didn't stay that way (of course, that is the essence of Christian belief at its core. (In future, there may be some interesting theological debates here at wIs.)

yes, david... that's your opinion. And some of us disagree. The question here is still relevant - we're disagreeing about it. There are some that argue that there's a rapture coming and some that argue that there's a rupture coming. We just need to create the venue to let people say which it's going to be.

by the way... i just cracked up at something I read about the "jesus died for my sins" thing... (had read it before but didn't remember)... uh...Jesus didn't die. At least he didn't stay dead... hysterical!

Nick, you are waxing Marxist, and your views on Christianity bear a striking resemblance to the views on religiosity expressed by Napoleon in Animal Farm. Unbecoming of a free-thinking capitalist indeed!

Perhaps the question should not be "Is Christianity a dying religion," for over the last 2,000 years reports of its death have surfaced only to discover that it is very much alive. It would seem to me that all of you are basing your arguments on numbers and scandals. Scandals far worse than those experienced in the modern era have surfaced in the Christian world and the faith has survived. As for the wealth argument-Jesus walked the earth as a poor man, in fact a homeless one! It was he who said that it would be easier for a camel to pass through the needle's eye than for a rich man to enter the Kingdom of God. It is not impossible by any means for the rich to be saved-it is just, by Christ's own admission, far more difficult. Thus, for any believer you can't make the case that because numbers are declining in the relatively rich and spoiled West that the Faith is declining. You'll get into the circular argument trap because I would argue, for example, that this is to be expected, it doesn't mean the Faith is dying.

The arguments presented on numbers, geography, and demographics do not point to a dying religion. Instead, they pose another question, with the numbers of Christians in China, Africa, and Latin America continuing to increase, and in some cases dramatically so:

Is the world center of Christianity shifting from the West to the East and the Global South? 

yeah, i say we pop it out there as is... i'm sold.

I've been reading a book about just how religious the founding fathers were - I think it's called "moral minority" or something like that. What you're pointing out is nothing new - during the enlightenment, education and wealth were a good litmus test for religious views. Christianity has always appealed to people that don't have it so good in this life and are looking for something better - and to those that don't want the rabble to figure things out and rise up....

Nick, I think this query hits the dilemma facing various clergies. Population patterns are shifting dramatically, more than ever there's a stark shift in who comprises a christian with the largest contigents emerging from Africa, China and growing in Latin America and with the steepest declines all coming from advanced or prosperous nations (Western Europe, Canada, Blue America and even pockets of Red America).  

And for some reason nobody wants to talk about that, religion is becoming the defacto poor man's government, there's a stark pattern emerging that eventually Christianity will be distinctly associated with the poor and under educated classes.  Higher social classes will eventually abandon it altogether in favor of a customised approach to spirituality, as evidenced by the patterns emerging.  I wonder how much data exists...it's really a great question.

Straight editors? I thought the world was gay out of a moral concern about over population and in the interest in saving the future of social security through non-reproduction, and saving the kids by adopting out of orphanages and foster homes? at least that was the info in the recruitment pamphlet I answered...

oh, i wrote a blog entry about this waaaay back and really pissed off a few people! I love this. The only concern is whether the phrase "dying religion" can be misconstrued. Everyone understands "dying language", etc. so it's probably fine... but could there be something that is less... say... shocking... to Christians?

Christianity is in one sense going through another "awakening", but in another, it's become so much about politics and enforcement of others' moralities - that the only valuable role of religions (i.e., to give hope to people that dream of an eternal life where they are better off than they were in the one they're mocking and squandering) is no longer the main focus.... But is it "dying" in terms of lessening numbers or in terms of competition? Perhaps that would call for another issue.... because I really like this one as is.

 I love this issue... I can see heart felt written treaties written based on this query.... the fact that so many questions about same-sex question are open for public consumption and discussion should make this one open and served family style...that's all I'm sayin', straight editors. 

Hope this isn't posted anywhere already....

This is always a hot one! My religions professor, also a Baptist minister, says numerically the answer is yes. anyone?